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	<title>Comments on: The Oxford Union does its thang&#8230;</title>
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	<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2007/11/the-oxford-union-does-its-thang/</link>
	<description>Two lawyers on law, legislation and liberty. And other stuff.</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 20 Nov 2008 12:32:06 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: Rafe Champion</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2007/11/the-oxford-union-does-its-thang/#comment-8702</link>
		<dc:creator>Rafe Champion</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Nov 2007 01:03:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.com/?p=3304#comment-8702</guid>
		<description>Surely there is no public policy issue, there are laws to cover violence, theft and vandalism.

The last thing we need are laws to enforce good manners, however much we value civility.

Thanks for the post SL, is there a list of past topics, I like the one "That this house will not swim the English Channel" are there others like that?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Surely there is no public policy issue, there are laws to cover violence, theft and vandalism.</p>
<p>The last thing we need are laws to enforce good manners, however much we value civility.</p>
<p>Thanks for the post SL, is there a list of past topics, I like the one &#8220;That this house will not swim the English Channel&#8221; are there others like that?</p>
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		<title>By: John Greenfield</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2007/11/the-oxford-union-does-its-thang/#comment-8701</link>
		<dc:creator>John Greenfield</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 30 Nov 2007 00:15:09 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.com/?p=3304#comment-8701</guid>
		<description>SL

Good on you for giving those unwashed limey sooks a jolly good bitchslapping! :) Reading about their carry-on, the first thing that popped into my head was how terribly common to become so emotional and irrational. Ask the history students, they will tell you it is very difficult to write a good essay about the war (WW2) in the east, without citing Irving as an authority. Irving is a traditional empiricist realist historian, not a slimey postmodernist. Thus, Irving is very easily tackled with the same methods.


I imagine that those "Independent Jewish Voices supporting Hamas" type organisations would have applauded Irving's presence on campus. ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>SL</p>
<p>Good on you for giving those unwashed limey sooks a jolly good bitchslapping! <img src='http://skepticlawyer.com.au/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> Reading about their carry-on, the first thing that popped into my head was how terribly common to become so emotional and irrational. Ask the history students, they will tell you it is very difficult to write a good essay about the war (WW2) in the east, without citing Irving as an authority. Irving is a traditional empiricist realist historian, not a slimey postmodernist. Thus, Irving is very easily tackled with the same methods.</p>
<p>I imagine that those &#8220;Independent Jewish Voices supporting Hamas&#8221; type organisations would have applauded Irving&#8217;s presence on campus. <img src='http://skepticlawyer.com.au/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif' alt=';)' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: Nanuestalker</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2007/11/the-oxford-union-does-its-thang/#comment-8700</link>
		<dc:creator>Nanuestalker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Nov 2007 10:41:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.com/?p=3304#comment-8700</guid>
		<description>SL -

Your stalker is quiet today and he promised. :(</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>SL -</p>
<p>Your stalker is quiet today and he promised. <img src='http://skepticlawyer.com.au/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_sad.gif' alt=':(' class='wp-smiley' /></p>
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		<title>By: Adrienswords</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2007/11/the-oxford-union-does-its-thang/#comment-8699</link>
		<dc:creator>Adrienswords</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Nov 2007 07:28:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.com/?p=3304#comment-8699</guid>
		<description>So Skeptic how does &lt;strike&gt;subsidized farnarkling&lt;/strike&gt; student politics break down in the UK. Are they dominated by the Natural Awfulness of Labor Students?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>So Skeptic how does <strike>subsidized farnarkling</strike> student politics break down in the UK. Are they dominated by the Natural Awfulness of Labor Students?</p>
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		<title>By: MichaelF</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2007/11/the-oxford-union-does-its-thang/#comment-8698</link>
		<dc:creator>MichaelF</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Nov 2007 05:52:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.com/?p=3304#comment-8698</guid>
		<description>Thanks for #16 SL. Only just read this thread (busy elsewhere). For the record, you are right.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks for #16 SL. Only just read this thread (busy elsewhere). For the record, you are right.</p>
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		<title>By: Nanuestalker</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2007/11/the-oxford-union-does-its-thang/#comment-8697</link>
		<dc:creator>Nanuestalker</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 29 Nov 2007 05:39:04 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.com/?p=3304#comment-8697</guid>
		<description>"The world doesnâ€™t owe the OU a living or perfectly provided services ..."

Should the Oxford Union be liable to such a degree for the excessive cost of protection from these rioters? It's ironic that an infamous society such as OU which always tackles contentious issues through open debate and discussion is portrayed in the press as being unconscionable for doing so and thereafter subject to a mob incited by the same press to act in such a ignorant fashion. Control the minds of the mob and increase your sales and/or advertising revenue I guess.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;The world doesnâ€™t owe the OU a living or perfectly provided services &#8230;&#8221;</p>
<p>Should the Oxford Union be liable to such a degree for the excessive cost of protection from these rioters? It&#8217;s ironic that an infamous society such as OU which always tackles contentious issues through open debate and discussion is portrayed in the press as being unconscionable for doing so and thereafter subject to a mob incited by the same press to act in such a ignorant fashion. Control the minds of the mob and increase your sales and/or advertising revenue I guess.</p>
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		<title>By: Bring Back CL's Blog</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2007/11/the-oxford-union-does-its-thang/#comment-8696</link>
		<dc:creator>Bring Back CL's Blog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2007 22:08:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.com/?p=3304#comment-8696</guid>
		<description>how can Oxford have a union. Didn't Dame Margaret get rid of them.

The country must be going to the dogs so everyone is barking mad!!

It is a great pity SL is in pommyland and not here</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>how can Oxford have a union. Didn&#8217;t Dame Margaret get rid of them.</p>
<p>The country must be going to the dogs so everyone is barking mad!!</p>
<p>It is a great pity SL is in pommyland and not here</p>
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		<title>By: Boris</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2007/11/the-oxford-union-does-its-thang/#comment-8695</link>
		<dc:creator>Boris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2007 14:23:10 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.com/?p=3304#comment-8695</guid>
		<description>SL does not explicitly say it is a public policy issue. But if she implied this, then I am with Jason. What kind of public policy issue is it? That free speech deserves special government protection at tax payers expense? I wouldn't support that.

As for acceptable vs unacceptable speech: yes, of course there is socially acceptable and socially unacceptable speech. There are some moral norms and this is good. For example behaviour of some commenters on Catallaxy would fall into the latter category in any civilised real-life discussion (however on blogs norms are different). The key is that it is none of the government's business, nothing more.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>SL does not explicitly say it is a public policy issue. But if she implied this, then I am with Jason. What kind of public policy issue is it? That free speech deserves special government protection at tax payers expense? I wouldn&#8217;t support that.</p>
<p>As for acceptable vs unacceptable speech: yes, of course there is socially acceptable and socially unacceptable speech. There are some moral norms and this is good. For example behaviour of some commenters on Catallaxy would fall into the latter category in any civilised real-life discussion (however on blogs norms are different). The key is that it is none of the government&#8217;s business, nothing more.</p>
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		<title>By: skepticlawyer</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2007/11/the-oxford-union-does-its-thang/#comment-8694</link>
		<dc:creator>skepticlawyer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2007 13:29:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.com/?p=3304#comment-8694</guid>
		<description>OT: what's your view of private security provision,  Jason? It's just I've been researching it for one of my papers over here, and it raises some interesting issues, both normative and empirical.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>OT: what&#8217;s your view of private security provision,  Jason? It&#8217;s just I&#8217;ve been researching it for one of my papers over here, and it raises some interesting issues, both normative and empirical.</p>
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		<title>By: Jason Soon</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2007/11/the-oxford-union-does-its-thang/#comment-8693</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason Soon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 28 Nov 2007 13:26:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.com/?p=3304#comment-8693</guid>
		<description>It doesn't matter - so they paid for additional security from the state police  because it was thought that the demands being placed on usual publicly funded security were disproportionate or they could have got it from a private provider. They took a risk and the amount of security needed probably was disproportionate. The culprits are those who took the protest too far and violated property rights, not the taxpayer.

I don't see the public policy issue. The world doesn't owe the OU a living or perfectly provided services (which do not exist - people get robbed all the time). As Boris said, they took a risk, got some publicity and if they really want to, they can sue the protesters to recoup the money. And the fact that they are non-profit or a community organisation is neither here nor there.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It doesn&#8217;t matter - so they paid for additional security from the state police  because it was thought that the demands being placed on usual publicly funded security were disproportionate or they could have got it from a private provider. They took a risk and the amount of security needed probably was disproportionate. The culprits are those who took the protest too far and violated property rights, not the taxpayer.</p>
<p>I don&#8217;t see the public policy issue. The world doesn&#8217;t owe the OU a living or perfectly provided services (which do not exist - people get robbed all the time). As Boris said, they took a risk, got some publicity and if they really want to, they can sue the protesters to recoup the money. And the fact that they are non-profit or a community organisation is neither here nor there.</p>
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