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	<title>Comments on: &#8216;It&#8217;s all downhill from here&#8230;&#8217;</title>
	<atom:link href="http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/04/its-all-downhill-from-here/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/04/its-all-downhill-from-here/</link>
	<description>Two lawyers on law, legislation and liberty. And other stuff.</description>
	<pubDate>Thu, 20 Nov 2008 18:03:30 +0000</pubDate>
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		<title>By: rog</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/04/its-all-downhill-from-here/#comment-9605</link>
		<dc:creator>rog</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Apr 2008 12:16:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.com/?p=3539#comment-9605</guid>
		<description>Hang on SL, is looking 'downloading' the same as 'looking?'</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hang on SL, is looking &#8216;downloading&#8217; the same as &#8216;looking?&#8217;</p>
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		<title>By: skepticlawyer</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/04/its-all-downhill-from-here/#comment-9604</link>
		<dc:creator>skepticlawyer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Apr 2008 10:56:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.com/?p=3539#comment-9604</guid>
		<description>The more I think about it, the more complicated it gets, JG. There is a part of me that's a bit pissed off with the OU for really going to town on the 'point-scoring' front, but they &lt;i&gt;do&lt;/i&gt; have a point about 'moral worthies' deciding to break in and trash other peoples' property in the name of their 'righteous cause'.

But to make it like this? And you are exactly right about the alcoholic/paedophile analogy.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The more I think about it, the more complicated it gets, JG. There is a part of me that&#8217;s a bit pissed off with the OU for really going to town on the &#8216;point-scoring&#8217; front, but they <i>do</i> have a point about &#8216;moral worthies&#8217; deciding to break in and trash other peoples&#8217; property in the name of their &#8216;righteous cause&#8217;.</p>
<p>But to make it like this? And you are exactly right about the alcoholic/paedophile analogy.</p>
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		<title>By: John Greenfield</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/04/its-all-downhill-from-here/#comment-9603</link>
		<dc:creator>John Greenfield</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Apr 2008 04:33:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.com/?p=3539#comment-9603</guid>
		<description>SL

There is just so much in your post that one could spend years discussing it. One point I will comment on is the comparison with alcoholics. A reasonably good analogy yes, except when a pedophile "busts" or "goes on a bender" the victim will not only be the pedophile.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>SL</p>
<p>There is just so much in your post that one could spend years discussing it. One point I will comment on is the comparison with alcoholics. A reasonably good analogy yes, except when a pedophile &#8220;busts&#8221; or &#8220;goes on a bender&#8221; the victim will not only be the pedophile.</p>
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		<title>By: skepticlawyer</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/04/its-all-downhill-from-here/#comment-9602</link>
		<dc:creator>skepticlawyer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Apr 2008 02:18:17 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.com/?p=3539#comment-9602</guid>
		<description>The Islamic world is always going to struggle with this - their prophet married a 9 year old, and he's considered worthy of imitation.

Many cultures tolerate marriage at around 14 - and it was pretty much universal in pre-modern times.

Interestingly, one of the classicists I know here who's researching this stuff says the evidence shows that the less sexist societies (eg Romans) would marry a 14-16 y.o. girl off to a 18-22 y.o man, while ancient Athens (women had no rights at all, basically) would commonly pair the 14 year old girl with a 30 year old man. She maintains the younger age at marriage across all  pre-modern cultures is largely a function of life-expectancy. In terms of gender relations, what matters is the age gap.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The Islamic world is always going to struggle with this - their prophet married a 9 year old, and he&#8217;s considered worthy of imitation.</p>
<p>Many cultures tolerate marriage at around 14 - and it was pretty much universal in pre-modern times.</p>
<p>Interestingly, one of the classicists I know here who&#8217;s researching this stuff says the evidence shows that the less sexist societies (eg Romans) would marry a 14-16 y.o. girl off to a 18-22 y.o man, while ancient Athens (women had no rights at all, basically) would commonly pair the 14 year old girl with a 30 year old man. She maintains the younger age at marriage across all  pre-modern cultures is largely a function of life-expectancy. In terms of gender relations, what matters is the age gap.</p>
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		<title>By: JC.</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/04/its-all-downhill-from-here/#comment-9601</link>
		<dc:creator>JC.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Apr 2008 01:46:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.com/?p=3539#comment-9601</guid>
		<description>From Jason's link:

&lt;i&gt;Majabin Mohammed, 13, at left, sits with her husband of six months, Mohammed Fazal, 45, his first wife and their child. Village elders advised him to accept Majabin as payment for a gambling debt&lt;/i&gt;

Win at poker and end up with a 13 year old.

I see you and raise you my 13 year old daughter.


-------------

As repulsive as these people are, I honestly don't see where the consumers of computer child porn are committing an offense. They are not the monsters violating these kids.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>From Jason&#8217;s link:</p>
<p><i>Majabin Mohammed, 13, at left, sits with her husband of six months, Mohammed Fazal, 45, his first wife and their child. Village elders advised him to accept Majabin as payment for a gambling debt</i></p>
<p>Win at poker and end up with a 13 year old.</p>
<p>I see you and raise you my 13 year old daughter.</p>
<p>&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;&#8212;-</p>
<p>As repulsive as these people are, I honestly don&#8217;t see where the consumers of computer child porn are committing an offense. They are not the monsters violating these kids.</p>
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		<title>By: John Hasenkam</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/04/its-all-downhill-from-here/#comment-9600</link>
		<dc:creator>John Hasenkam</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Apr 2008 01:43:41 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.com/?p=3539#comment-9600</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;I think ultimately this is an organic disease and I don’t believe in mind over matter. The only sort of therapy that can work is chemical.&lt;/i&gt;

I have read studies suggesting the brain imaging is similiar to that seen in sociopathy, and Terje once commented he had read that chemical castration had little effect on their habits(long time ago).

Short of refining chemical castration there is no chemical solution, there is no specific target in the brain that a chemical can attack.

Mind over matter? Behavioral therapy appears to be working, but I'll withhold a judgment on that! In other contexts though "mind over matter"(misleading dichotomy) therapies have proved rather rather successful.

There is one chemical that works really well on these people: lead.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>I think ultimately this is an organic disease and I don’t believe in mind over matter. The only sort of therapy that can work is chemical.</i></p>
<p>I have read studies suggesting the brain imaging is similiar to that seen in sociopathy, and Terje once commented he had read that chemical castration had little effect on their habits(long time ago).</p>
<p>Short of refining chemical castration there is no chemical solution, there is no specific target in the brain that a chemical can attack.</p>
<p>Mind over matter? Behavioral therapy appears to be working, but I&#8217;ll withhold a judgment on that! In other contexts though &#8220;mind over matter&#8221;(misleading dichotomy) therapies have proved rather rather successful.</p>
<p>There is one chemical that works really well on these people: lead.</p>
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		<title>By: Jason Soon</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/04/its-all-downhill-from-here/#comment-9599</link>
		<dc:creator>Jason Soon</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Apr 2008 01:35:45 +0000</pubDate>
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		<description>Standards haven't changed in Afghanistan

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5541006</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Standards haven&#8217;t changed in Afghanistan</p>
<p><a href="http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5541006" rel="nofollow">http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=5541006</a></p>
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		<title>By: skepticlawyer</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/04/its-all-downhill-from-here/#comment-9598</link>
		<dc:creator>skepticlawyer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Apr 2008 01:32:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.com/?p=3539#comment-9598</guid>
		<description>I think our standards have changed, too, JC. The question is whether the change is for the better, or mixed (likely to be the latter, as with all these things).

I wonder if paedophilia in particular is like alcoholism - the only way to beat it is complete abstinence. Alcoholics struggle with their addiction every day, even when they haven't touched a drop for 25 years.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think our standards have changed, too, JC. The question is whether the change is for the better, or mixed (likely to be the latter, as with all these things).</p>
<p>I wonder if paedophilia in particular is like alcoholism - the only way to beat it is complete abstinence. Alcoholics struggle with their addiction every day, even when they haven&#8217;t touched a drop for 25 years.</p>
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		<title>By: JC.</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/04/its-all-downhill-from-here/#comment-9597</link>
		<dc:creator>JC.</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Apr 2008 01:29:12 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.com/?p=3539#comment-9597</guid>
		<description>&lt;i&gt;Are we more concerned about sex offences because they’re commoner than they once were, or are they commoner because we’re more concerned about them?&lt;/i&gt;


Elvis had the hots for his future wife when he first her.  She was 13.

I think our standards have changed.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p><i>Are we more concerned about sex offences because they’re commoner than they once were, or are they commoner because we’re more concerned about them?</i></p>
<p>Elvis had the hots for his future wife when he first her.  She was 13.</p>
<p>I think our standards have changed.</p>
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		<title>By: GMB</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/04/its-all-downhill-from-here/#comment-9596</link>
		<dc:creator>GMB</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 20 Apr 2008 01:29:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://catallaxyfiles.com/?p=3539#comment-9596</guid>
		<description>No good. You cannot go easy on these people Jason. Because there are these horrid creatures called leftists.

Once people are desensitized to this sick shit the leftists will be giving these rock spiders the medal of freedom and running legal defense for pedophile rings in the midst of a pandemic of missing children.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>No good. You cannot go easy on these people Jason. Because there are these horrid creatures called leftists.</p>
<p>Once people are desensitized to this sick shit the leftists will be giving these rock spiders the medal of freedom and running legal defense for pedophile rings in the midst of a pandemic of missing children.</p>
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