<?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Fascism Friday &#8211; Die Welle</title>
	<atom:link href="http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/09/20/fascism-friday-die-welle/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/09/20/fascism-friday-die-welle/</link>
	<description>Two lawyers and a larrikin on life, law and liberty.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 19 Mar 2010 11:04:35 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=2.9.2</generator>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
		<item>
		<title>By: Adrien</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/09/20/fascism-friday-die-welle/comment-page-1/#comment-59605</link>
		<dc:creator>Adrien</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 10 Mar 2010 02:19:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://skepticlawyer.com.au/?p=880#comment-59605</guid>
		<description>Why thank you. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Why thank you. <img src='http://skepticlawyer.com.au/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' /> </p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Ignacio</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/09/20/fascism-friday-die-welle/comment-page-1/#comment-59500</link>
		<dc:creator>Ignacio</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 09 Mar 2010 05:31:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://skepticlawyer.com.au/?p=880#comment-59500</guid>
		<description>I just wanted to say that the previous comment was absolutely brilliant. The movie certainly shows how this kind of movement is born. Nazis didn&#039;t come out of nowhere, people had a major influence on the development of that regime and it&#039;s not the first or last time it&#039;s happened. I&#039;m from Argentina and here each time we had a military coup-de-etat people asked for it, and there&#039;s still people supporting that kind of fascist intervention nowadays.

The situation displayed in the movie, although impossible to occur in a week, is absolutely possible in any other period of time, maybe even not much longer than that. The movie is an excellent portait of fascism and domination-through-ignorance.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I just wanted to say that the previous comment was absolutely brilliant. The movie certainly shows how this kind of movement is born. Nazis didn&#8217;t come out of nowhere, people had a major influence on the development of that regime and it&#8217;s not the first or last time it&#8217;s happened. I&#8217;m from Argentina and here each time we had a military coup-de-etat people asked for it, and there&#8217;s still people supporting that kind of fascist intervention nowadays.</p>
<p>The situation displayed in the movie, although impossible to occur in a week, is absolutely possible in any other period of time, maybe even not much longer than that. The movie is an excellent portait of fascism and domination-through-ignorance.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Adrien</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/09/20/fascism-friday-die-welle/comment-page-1/#comment-24395</link>
		<dc:creator>Adrien</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jan 2009 09:00:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://skepticlawyer.com.au/?p=880#comment-24395</guid>
		<description>There&#039;s a lot of German film exploring unpleasant things, especially things in German history. Including the &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0765432/&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Baader-Meinhof&lt;/a&gt; episode.

When one of these films &lt;i&gt;The Downfall&lt;/i&gt; abut Hitler&#039;s last days in the bunker came out there was outrage because the film was said to &#039;humanize&#039; him and other high ranking Nazis.

Well humanize him it did. In the sense of presenting him as a human being. He wasn&#039;t, however &#039;a nice guy&#039;. His charms were displayed, so was his murderous obstinence, his refusal to surrender even tho&#039; thousands of German kids were being cut down by Soviet soldiers for no reason not to mention his bizarre tantrums.

Still what is represented is a human being not some mythical monstrosity and that is what people objected to. Like the fury of Jewish people at Hannah Arendt for presenting Eichmann as a mere bureaucratic functionary (in addition to her less than complimentary and ironically intra-Jewish racialist observations on the Israeli courts) what was desired - nay &lt;i&gt;demanded&lt;/i&gt; -  was that Eichmann, Hitler and the rest were &lt;i&gt;not&lt;/i&gt; human. Outside of humanity.

But this tendency to dehumanize the enemy, to rid oneself of the uneasy truth that we are all to a certain extent monsters is idiosyncratically human and observable in every war. Indeed the masters of it were the Nazis. 

I think the Manichean illusion that &#039;we&#039; are not capable of monstrosity ironically condemns us to bear witness to monsters in the future. Unfortunately it&#039;s so morally convenient to simply rest smug on our conceptions of our own virtues that it&#039;s very difficult to make people face the abyss. Moreover he vast majority of us simply haven&#039;t the courage.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>There&#8217;s a lot of German film exploring unpleasant things, especially things in German history. Including the <a href="http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0765432/" rel="nofollow">Baader-Meinhof</a> episode.</p>
<p>When one of these films <i>The Downfall</i> abut Hitler&#8217;s last days in the bunker came out there was outrage because the film was said to &#8216;humanize&#8217; him and other high ranking Nazis.</p>
<p>Well humanize him it did. In the sense of presenting him as a human being. He wasn&#8217;t, however &#8216;a nice guy&#8217;. His charms were displayed, so was his murderous obstinence, his refusal to surrender even tho&#8217; thousands of German kids were being cut down by Soviet soldiers for no reason not to mention his bizarre tantrums.</p>
<p>Still what is represented is a human being not some mythical monstrosity and that is what people objected to. Like the fury of Jewish people at Hannah Arendt for presenting Eichmann as a mere bureaucratic functionary (in addition to her less than complimentary and ironically intra-Jewish racialist observations on the Israeli courts) what was desired &#8211; nay <i>demanded</i> &#8211;  was that Eichmann, Hitler and the rest were <i>not</i> human. Outside of humanity.</p>
<p>But this tendency to dehumanize the enemy, to rid oneself of the uneasy truth that we are all to a certain extent monsters is idiosyncratically human and observable in every war. Indeed the masters of it were the Nazis. </p>
<p>I think the Manichean illusion that &#8216;we&#8217; are not capable of monstrosity ironically condemns us to bear witness to monsters in the future. Unfortunately it&#8217;s so morally convenient to simply rest smug on our conceptions of our own virtues that it&#8217;s very difficult to make people face the abyss. Moreover he vast majority of us simply haven&#8217;t the courage.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: skepticlawyer</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/09/20/fascism-friday-die-welle/comment-page-1/#comment-24379</link>
		<dc:creator>skepticlawyer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jan 2009 00:46:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://skepticlawyer.com.au/?p=880#comment-24379</guid>
		<description>I got the impression that there was a bit of both involved, in that people (especially teachers) like to think they&#039;ve got everything under control... and then it blows up in their hands, like a kid playing with crackers on Bonfire Night. This is a genuinely scary film in part because it strips away all pretenses, including the pretense that we can stay in control.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I got the impression that there was a bit of both involved, in that people (especially teachers) like to think they&#8217;ve got everything under control&#8230; and then it blows up in their hands, like a kid playing with crackers on Bonfire Night. This is a genuinely scary film in part because it strips away all pretenses, including the pretense that we can stay in control.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: DeusExMacintosh</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/09/20/fascism-friday-die-welle/comment-page-1/#comment-24300</link>
		<dc:creator>DeusExMacintosh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Jan 2009 23:04:58 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://skepticlawyer.com.au/?p=880#comment-24300</guid>
		<description>I think the latter... in realising that what began as basically a mischievous prank on his part (designed to stir the establishment) ended up killing someone.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think the latter&#8230; in realising that what began as basically a mischievous prank on his part (designed to stir the establishment) ended up killing someone.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: steve</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/09/20/fascism-friday-die-welle/comment-page-1/#comment-24265</link>
		<dc:creator>steve</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 18 Jan 2009 02:23:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://skepticlawyer.com.au/?p=880#comment-24265</guid>
		<description>What does the teacher realize at the end?  He gets a look of surprise on his face?  Is it disbelief that he just shut down that power? Or that he created that disaster?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What does the teacher realize at the end?  He gets a look of surprise on his face?  Is it disbelief that he just shut down that power? Or that he created that disaster?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: skepticlawyer</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/09/20/fascism-friday-die-welle/comment-page-1/#comment-17485</link>
		<dc:creator>skepticlawyer</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Sep 2008 22:32:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://skepticlawyer.com.au/?p=880#comment-17485</guid>
		<description>Not sure. The commercial cinema release in the UK has subtitles, but none of the versions on the net do - including the one I originally watched. I presume one will turn up in due course if the film stays popular in the UK.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Not sure. The commercial cinema release in the UK has subtitles, but none of the versions on the net do &#8211; including the one I originally watched. I presume one will turn up in due course if the film stays popular in the UK.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: tudor</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/09/20/fascism-friday-die-welle/comment-page-1/#comment-17483</link>
		<dc:creator>tudor</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Sep 2008 21:58:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://skepticlawyer.com.au/?p=880#comment-17483</guid>
		<description>does anyone know where i can find an english subtitle for this movie pls?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>does anyone know where i can find an english subtitle for this movie pls?</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Adrien</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/09/20/fascism-friday-die-welle/comment-page-1/#comment-17054</link>
		<dc:creator>Adrien</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 24 Sep 2008 10:43:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://skepticlawyer.com.au/?p=880#comment-17054</guid>
		<description>&lt;blockquote&gt;‘obedience to authority’ is one of those awful mixed blessings we humans just have to manage. There’s nothing uniquely German about it, even though it would be easier for many people if that were the case.&lt;/blockquote&gt;

It&#039;s part of being a primate in fact. Carl Sagan had wonderful phrasing for this referring to scientists who irrationally capitulate to authority. There are few people capable of resisting authority when needed, mostly misfits. Literary characters usually come to mind: Berenger in Ionesco&#039;s &lt;i&gt;Rhinoceros&lt;/i&gt; being one. 

We&#039;re hard wired to accept authoritarian dictates as &#039;moral&#039; even when they&#039;re obviously not. Fortunately we&#039;re also inherently paradoxical and strive in the opposite direction as well. I think to do so successfully necessitates acknowledging unpleasant facts. Many rational hedonists were completely baffled by the spectacle of Nazi Germany. They simply didn&#039;t understand the utter Unreason.  Orwell who did pointed out that it was what he called &#039;half-fascists&#039; like Winston Churchill (his example) who recognized Hitler for what he was before anyone else.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<blockquote><p>‘obedience to authority’ is one of those awful mixed blessings we humans just have to manage. There’s nothing uniquely German about it, even though it would be easier for many people if that were the case.</p></blockquote>
<p>It&#8217;s part of being a primate in fact. Carl Sagan had wonderful phrasing for this referring to scientists who irrationally capitulate to authority. There are few people capable of resisting authority when needed, mostly misfits. Literary characters usually come to mind: Berenger in Ionesco&#8217;s <i>Rhinoceros</i> being one. </p>
<p>We&#8217;re hard wired to accept authoritarian dictates as &#8216;moral&#8217; even when they&#8217;re obviously not. Fortunately we&#8217;re also inherently paradoxical and strive in the opposite direction as well. I think to do so successfully necessitates acknowledging unpleasant facts. Many rational hedonists were completely baffled by the spectacle of Nazi Germany. They simply didn&#8217;t understand the utter Unreason.  Orwell who did pointed out that it was what he called &#8216;half-fascists&#8217; like Winston Churchill (his example) who recognized Hitler for what he was before anyone else.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: DeusExMacintosh</title>
		<link>http://skepticlawyer.com.au/2008/09/20/fascism-friday-die-welle/comment-page-1/#comment-16783</link>
		<dc:creator>DeusExMacintosh</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 21 Sep 2008 12:26:36 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://skepticlawyer.com.au/?p=880#comment-16783</guid>
		<description>And yet they had no problem distributing &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRSiA6g1A-4&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;Elephant&lt;/a&gt;...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>And yet they had no problem distributing <a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tRSiA6g1A-4" rel="nofollow">Elephant</a>&#8230;</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>
